How Does a Family Doctor See 30 Patients a Day?

• #1

I inquire this question because I am shadowing a family doc in his practice that is seeing 60 patients a day. Almost of them are followups but he spends like 5 minutes per patient. It seems similar a lot only it'south pretty impressive, I don't actually know what to make of information technology. Is that normal? How much money is this guy making? Is he similar making banking concern or something and comprising patient intendance? This is in a pretty poor neighborhood/city.

• #three

I mean if people on here are talking about seeing 25 patients a 24-hour interval and making 250k a year and then this guy must be making upwards of 400k seeing that many patients. Although I don't think that is in the best interest of the patient, what the hell do I know lol. He's an american Exercise btw.

• #iv

I mean if people on hither are talking virtually seeing 25 patients a day and making 250k a twelvemonth then this guy must be making upwards of 400k seeing that many patients. Although I don't call up that is in the best involvement of the patient, what the hell do I know lol. He's an american DO btw.

I bet it's more similar 600k. Y'all can run the numbers yourself. Just effigy out the medicare reimbursements for a routine established visit (99213 or 99214), multiply that past 60pts/twenty-four hour period X 5days/calendar week X 48 working weeks in a year. Also don't forget to deduct ~one/two of the gross corporeality for overhead cost.

• #5

I bet information technology'due south more than like 600k. You can run the numbers yourself. Merely effigy out the medicare reimbursements for a routine established visit (99213 or 99214), multiply that by 60pts/day X 5days/week X 48 working weeks in a year. Too don't forget to deduct ~one/2 of the gross corporeality for overhead cost.

That'southward pretty insane, he doesn't even seem that well off just a little practice with him, his MA, ane nurse and i receptionist girl. Very interesting.

• #seven

That'southward pretty insane, he doesn't fifty-fifty seem that well off but a petty exercise with him, his MA, one nurse and one receptionist girl. Very interesting.

Depends on the payer mix

• #8

Commonly around six patients per day. I'm full time merely I accept a Directly Primary Intendance (DPC) practice so my panel is much smaller and I handle a lot of issues over the phone (if medically advisable).

When I owned an insurance oriented practice I'd run across but eighteen-xx just that was mainly because I had a very geriatric population with multiple chronic problems and little peds. Back then information technology was almost all 99214s with a 99215 many days and few 99213s.

• #9

Location and insurance are big factors. If yous don't see whatsoever Medicaid your day becomes more manageable. Likewise, if your practice is a PCMH exercise, there's no way you can be efficient. PCMH means Patient Intendance Must Halt.

• #10

Location and insurance are big factors. If you lot don't run across any Medicaid your day becomes more manageable. Also, if your exercise is a PCMH practice, there'southward no mode you can exist efficient. PCMH means Patient Care Must Halt.

Can you elaborate I don't really understand what you mean?

• #xi

I work urgent care 12 60 minutes shifts. I saw 43 yesterday, 26 today. 25-30 is my boilerplate just generally my twenty-four hours is one complaint and I don't do any chronic med refills or preventative things like mammo, colonoscopy, etc.

• #thirteen

PCMH has killed the simple and efficient triage of a patient, and killed the simple only meaningful progress note. There is now a list of things your MA must do during the triage process of every unmarried patient. Besides, there is a list of boxes docs must check on every single note. It now takes twice as long to triage a patient than it used to.

Medicaid patients come up with medicaid bug. Typically, their trouble listing and med lists are much, much longer compared to a private pay patient. They run into you more than frequently. Not only do you have to give due diligence to their chronic problems only they'll usually have at least a couple acute bug that need to be addressed at each office visit. The visits last longer, the notes are longer, they phone call your front function more and y'all end up getting paid less for information technology. I see a big amount of medicaid patients and it tin be draining.

My beginning job out of residency was a medicaid/care clinic the local Catholic hospital set to take force per unit area of their ER and y'all've described the situation perfectly.

• #xvi

One of the more attractive things I hear about DPC is the absolute lack of demand of documentation. Nearly of the stuff we do is for insurance purposes anyway......but I digress....

Yeah, I am a psychiatrist and I hear like things from cash-simply private practice psychiatrists out there - if you don't take to cater to the insurance companies, you lot can only focusing on documenting the clinically relevant details! Sounds well-nigh besides good to be true, doesn't it? I can't imagine how much more than time I'd take if I could just jot a quick note near what is actually going on with the patient rather than clicking a bunch of boxes in Epic.

• #17

Only, I hope marking v answered your question. He put it quite well.

• #xviii

Merely, I promise mark five answered your question. He put it quite well.

Aye he did, I'one thousand just actually worried about the future of medicine since I actually want to exist in a field that will allow me to prepare my own do and not be employed and I thought that FM was the specialty most resistant to that but I think that all of medicine may be going in the way of us being employed sooner or afterward.

• #xx

Derm and Ophthal are still very friendly to setting up yor own store. Insurance still has their claws in your pocket, but in that location'south no political clamoring for more 'access' to those fields then the government seems to be leaving them lone more compared to us. I wish I could say I see the landscape getting simpler, merely I'd be lying to y'all and myself.

For now, urgent care actually however does pretty well and is possible to set up up your own shop. They're non locked down past PCMH and the nature of the visits go reasonably fast.

Uhh, not and then much. Why don't you go ask an ophthalmologist what their electric current cataract reimbursement is from Medicare?

• #21

But wait guys, can someone put me at ease by saying that FM will ever allow the business minded to open upwards shop? Or are we in such a bad situation that in 15-20 years we all actually have to exist employed at mega corporate hospital systems?

• #22

He'south probably non making much. Family docs piece of work like animals and very few make a lot of money. Inexpensive paying patients and high overhead. Best bet for FM docs at to the lowest degree today is to get to underserved areas. At present you can brand money if you are very smart and get into the business organisation aspect of things but that tin be said for any profession.

• #23

He's probably not making much. Family docs work like animals and very few make a lot of coin. Inexpensive paying patients and high overhead. Best bet for FM docs at least today is to go to underserved areas. At present you tin make money if you are very smart and get into the business aspect of things but that can be said for any profession.

Someone earlier said he was making similar 600k, can you explain why you disagree with that person?

• #25

Someone earlier said he was making like 600k, can you explain why you disagree with that person?

Personal feel mainly. I have never been in contact with a FM guy making that money. I accept rotated with several in the big cities too every bit one in rural mid america working for the govt. I am sure many family unit docs do well for themselves but those who are making 300+ are probably more involved in business concern ventures (botox, venous ablations, etc). Overhead is big and patients don't pay much it is as uncomplicated as that. At least for private practise guys.

The private practice guys were ripping through patients all mean solar day nonstop while the other guys lived a much more relaxed lifestyle. Pros and Cons.

• #26

Simply expect guys, can someone put me at ease past saying that FM will ever let the business concern minded to open upwards store? Or are nosotros in such a bad situation that in 15-xx years nosotros all really take to be employed at mega corporate infirmary systems?

Family docs work like animals and very few make a lot of coin. Cheap paying patients and high overhead. All-time bet for FM docs at least today is to become to underserved areas.

Nobody can guarantee annihilation over the next 20 years and whatsoever of us who went FM over the terminal xx years already have one bad business concern decision to our credit.

The best best for the foreseeable future is Direct Primary Intendance. It's affordable plenty for working course patients then you can set up shop nearly anywhere. There are risks to DPC but they are far less than the risks of being an employee at a subsidized, loss leader clinic for big systems and patients that likely will replace you with a less expensive midlevel at some signal. The worklife in DPC is equally hard as any chief care or residency lifestyle during the startup phase but so becomes much more sane with smaller panels and far fewer visits per day. The pay, depending upon how yous set upwards your business concern model, is competitive with whatsoever chief care or hospitalist jobs and many other specialities.

• #27

Nobody tin can guarantee annihilation over the next twenty years and any of us who went FM over the last twenty years already take ane bad business decision to our credit.

The best best for the foreseeable future is Direct Primary Care. It'south affordable enough for working class patients so you can set shop well-nigh anywhere. There are risks to DPC merely they are far less than the risks of being an employee at a subsidized, loss leader clinic for large systems and patients that likely will replace you with a less expensive midlevel at some indicate. The worklife in DPC is as difficult as whatever master care or residency lifestyle during the startup phase only then becomes much more sane with smaller panels and far fewer visits per twenty-four hour period. The pay, depending upon how you set up your business model, is competitive with any chief care or hospitalist jobs and many other specialities.

You lot think your choice to become into FM was a bad business organisation conclusion? What would you have pursued instead?

• #28

FM could be a great specialty just as the family unit breadwinner over the final 20 years information technology'due south cost my family and me quite a bit financially compared to whatsoever number of subspecialties like GI. To make matters worse, early in my career I joined a group practice non likewise many years before private practices started dying right and left here and around the state.

• #29

FM could exist a swell specialty but as the family unit breadwinner over the last xx years it'southward price my family and me quite a chip financially compared to any number of subspecialties similar GI. To make matters worse, early in my career I joined a group practice not besides many years before private practices started dying right and left hither and around the state.

Why is private practice dying around you? People on hither are saying that PP is still very possible if you are business minded

• #30

Why is private practice dying around yous? People on hither are maxim that PP is withal very possible if you are business minded

Possible doesn't hateful the best option... Between overhead, reduced insurance reimbursements, rising healthcare $$, lower top salaries and malpractice PP is more and more than difficult. Even PP groups that take been around for a long fourth dimension often sell their practices to hospital corporations for the reasons mentioned.

• #31

Possible doesn't mean the best option... Between overhead, reduced insurance reimbursements, rising healthcare $$, lower top salaries and malpractice PP is more than and more hard. Even PP groups that have been effectually for a long time oft sell their practices to infirmary corporations for the reasons mentioned.

Very true, but equally mentioned above by several posters, information technology seems similar lots of PP physicians are still able to make decent money, at least I hope that's the case!

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Source: https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/how-many-patients-do-you-see-per-day.1220883/

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